The electrical shutdown in my area today turned out to be total dud—we didn’t even have to reset our clocks. OTOH, I had an enforced day off, and we spent the morning of a beautiful day at the Botanic Garden, so not all was lost. The big headline story today is that Israel bombed a hospital in Gaza that was packed with panicked residents seeking safe shelter. Little did they know. The death count varies—as low as 300, as high as 900 are the numbers I’ve seen. Here’s a story that says 500:
Day 11 — Middle East War Briefing. All major media sources are focused on the War in Israel and not much other news is getting through the noise.
💣 The “big news” yesterday was a hospital in in the middle of northern Gaza’s air raid zone blew up and a lot of people were killed and wounded. The Israelis had warned the hospital many times to evacuate, but it did not, not even after bombs fell all around it during previous air strikes, just as the Israelis had warned, nor did it evacuate its patients and staff even after the water and power was cut off.
It was just the opposite of evacuated. The hospital was packed with hundreds or even thousands of civilian noncombatants who were there, not for treatment, but for “shelter,” presumably trusting the Israelis not to bomb the hospital even after repeatedly warning the hospital could get bombed.
While the rubble was still burning, Hamas filmed horrifying shock videos of mangled bodies and scorched toys, and outraged pandemonium instantly ensued worldwide as people reacted angrily against Israel (for doing exactly what it said it would) with white-hot hot takes and violently jerking knees.
But then a twist appeared when, a few hours later, Israel published data and videos appearing to contradict the battle-hardened narrative.
Israel made the mistake of using logic instead of emotion. It claimed that, number one, it did not conduct any air strikes in that area of Gaza yesterday. Two, it reported Hamas launched 1,500 rockets toward Israel right down the block from the hospital, a few seconds before the explosion. Third, the IDF said 40% of Hamas rockets normally malfunction and often hit friendlies by accident. Fourth, at least three local videos, two released by Hamas, appear to show the Hamas rocket launch with one fireball returning to earth along with an explosion. Fifth, Israel claimed the Hamas rocket actually fell into the hospital parking lot, and video evidence appeared to support that claim.
Then later, while hardliners nitpicked the first five pieces of evidence, Israel released an audio intercept between two Hamas operatives who appeared to confirm the explosion was caused by a Hamas rocket. One can be heard explaining, “It seems that they fired this from the cemetery behind the hospital, then the way that it failed and it landed on the hospital.”
image 6.png
SOURCE: IDF audio intercept (gibberish with English transcript).
It is weird how the IDF intercepted this particular discussion but somehow missed all the discussions that might’ve warned them of the original Hamas attack, but I digress.
The developing story and Israel’s persuasive videos, argument, and audio caused newspaper editors’ heads to spin faster than John Fetterman hanging for dear life onto a whirling childrens’ merry-go-round. Here’s one great example: What would we do without the New York Times and its stealth editors? Behold, three papers in one day!
image 3.png
For what it’s worth, during his short visit yesterday, Joe Biden carefully* reviewed the evidence about the explosion and is siding with Israel. But of course, Biden mangled it, unaccountably referring to Hamas as “the other team,” as though the deadly conflict is some kind of sporting event:
(* results may vary)
image 2.png
CLIP: Biden languidly whispers deep sadness and outrage and sides with Israel (0:22).
Probably Biden just forgot Hamas’ name, and “the other team” remark was a sundowner technique to cover for the embarrassing gaffe.
Can you imagine poor Netanyahu having to smile through an entire meeting with Biden talking that slow? According to reports, the men met for “longer than expected,” which was just over an hour. I think we can agree the meeting was extended because Biden talked so slow and Bibi had to keep asking Joe’s handlers to explain what he just said.
To be clear: I take no position on who’s to blame for the hospital, because how could I? I don’t have access to the evidence. Neither does anybody else, and so nobody should be reacting emotionally (except perhaps over for the general tragedy of war). But at this point, Israel has presented a credible defense, and the burden of proof has shifted back to the Palestinians to prove that the explosion was not caused by one of their own rockets. They also need to explain why the hospital wasn’t reduced to a skeleton staff after the original Israeli evacuation warnings.
It’ll be a long, emotionally-exhausting war if everyone scrutinizes and argues over every single rocket strike and civilian casualty like this.
I'm getting a "Forbidden: Access to this resource on the server is denied!" message when I try to open the link. Is anyone else getting this response? I've tried alternate browsers w/o success...
Looks like the Hospital "bombing" never happened. We all got snookered by a massive media-driven disinformation campaign. Hospital is still there, intact other than some broken windows. No impact crater. Damage to cars apparently from malfunctioning rocket that hit the parking lot.
It is also worth remembering, when you try to understand events in most of the world, that there are only two religions in the world that actually set any value on human life: Judaism and Christianity (and not all of their supposed adherents are always consistent about it. But Muslims set no value at all on the lives of non-Muslims, and in practice show little regard for even the lives of Muslims. And the Muslim teachings about the nature of Allah are extremely different from the Christian teachings about the nature of God.
Incidentally, in the Bosnian conflict it was common practice by Muslim forces to commit mass civilian deaths in their own ranks for propaganda….just saying.
I’m very worried about Saudi / Gulf state funding of fundamentalist Islam worldwide.
This has moved Islam worldwide to be more conservative theough funding of Madrasses, Mosques, various “charities”, and even Sunni Jihadists.
It’s an elephant in the room the us ignores, because the Saudis and Gulf States are our Allies and fear of being accused of Islamaphobia. Not to mention their leverage due to oil.
I'm concerned about the spread of all false ideologies: jihadist, zionist, transhumanist, etc. The US funds most to all the worst false ideologies, as Putin recently pointed out.
"The Biden administration fears Israel has no real plan and the conflict may spiral unpredictably." I just woke my dog up laughing at that one. The Biden Regime is obviously speaking from experience. Concerning Jewish extremists, we always associated US Jews as being democrats. However, there is a significant group of extremists Jews in America too who are pushing this lunacy and the settlement movement. Eschatological indeed.
People should probably be more aware that according to United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, Israel hit this same hospital just a few days ago.
"This is just the way things are. Carrier battle groups don’t deter the eschatological beliefs of either Jews or Muslims. Or Christians, for that matter. The inability of our rulers to wrap their heads around that is what people like Alistair Crooke term a “lack of empathy.” You can’t defuse a situation if you’re unable to get a “feel” for the worldview of the parties involved."
All absolutely true. Even worse, the people we are trying to bluff (or not) would be happy to have us drawn into this disaster.
Whatever the neocons do, Ray, it will be a colossal screw-up. All we can do is protect ourselves and our families until the crazed elephants lumber off the scene.
I have refrained from commenting on this whole onset of war between Israel and Hamas over the last week because of my own lack of time, lack of specific knowledge of background and events, and because these issues and questions are so politically and emotionally charged. Also, the rule of waiting to see what shakes out is a good one. Thank you Mark for your courageous endeavors to throw light on this situation as it has unfolded and also I appreciate as always the many insightful comments put forward by this community.
All that said, with the vortex of escalation we seem to be in amidst the known knowns, the known unknowns, and the unknown unknowns that persist, I think I can reasonably state the following:
1) No one seems to want peace or de-escalation. The U.S. state department has instructed its people to refrain from using such language in their statements. Also:
"A series of statements from multiple sides point toward continued escalation, which could explode well beyond the Gaza crisis:
* Israel Ministry of Health: "The war may last a long time, prepare an emergency stock of food for 4 months."
* Iranian Foreign Minister: "The expansion of the war to other fronts has begun to reach unavoidable stages."
* IDF Spokesman: "Israel is prepared on its own both in the north and in the south."
2) That the IDF would not be in position to prevent the initial Hamas attack on Oct 7 beggars belief. So either someone in the IDF or someone with authority over the IDF must be held responsible for that situation, along with Hamas. Israel has said they are "looking into it." Will we ever hear who was responsible for such gross negligence? What if it was purposeful rather than negligent? In this regard, thank you to the several commenters who linked to the Efrat Fennigson / Bret Weinstein interview (https://rumble.com/v3oewxb-the-israel-attacks-beyond-the-obvious-with-efrat-fenigson.html).
3) One would have to think that purposefully bombing a hospital in Gaza would in ordinary circumstances be an amazing act of evil and stupidity if done by Israel. It effectively sabotaged Biden's trip (Jordan and Palestine have already cancelled out) and put the U.S. in an incredibly difficult diplomatic position vis-a-vis Israel and the ME as a whole. That is, unless someone in the Israeli government or military WANTS all out war and believes Israel can win one. On the other hand of course, Hamas (and Iran) would have ample incentive for doing this to totally cut off Israel from the world's sympathy and the U.S.'s aid.
4) Regardless of the whos and whats and whys of all this, in the end Russia, China, and the BRICs will benefit from this conflict in the long term, and the U.S. and Israel will be damaged by it.
5) I am waiting to see where the "cooler heads" who might prevail come from. It should be a pretty simple process of elimination when you subtract those who consistently promote peace through their words and actions from those who do not.
One of analyses cited by Israel was an outfit that claimed a Hamas rocket blew up in the air and that part of it fell on the hospital. That's another very weak non-explanation. So far I haven't been wrong about the propaganda. If this is the first, then so be it. The point that I'll make if that does happen is that it was accidental and not deliberate, like the Israeli bombardment that has killed thousands and injured many thousands more.
One of the reports I saw was that there were multiple explosions--the original rocket or whatever that set it off, and then explosions from the building itself. Hamas has a long record of using civilian sites for its activities, and possibly for munitions storage. And this would not be the first time one of their rocket attacks killed their own people; I have seen reports of that happening for several years.
According to this report on Townhall, the rockets were set off by Islamic Jihad, not Hamas.
One thing I have been hearing for years is, when some event happens, don't jump to conclusions instantly--wait for a bit. I think that principle applies here.
The Al Jazeera video captured it. They stopped the video right after it hit. With the damage claimed, it would need to be bigger than the usual missile warhead, unless their was a secondary explosion. Disclaimer - May be it was a super large missile with a warhead big enough to do the damage, but those have not been used by the Palestinian side yet.
A bigger issue is it may not matter who’s at fault, if the Arab World believes Israel did it.
Slightly OT: I've just finished reading Grand Deception, Alex Krainer's tour de force takedown of Bill Browder, the Harvard Boys and the Neocon obsession with destroying Russia. I must say I will listen to Alex Krainer even more carefully than I might otherwise have with the Grand Deception in the back of my mind. I strongly recommend it. (If you can find it...its banned on Amazon but I managed to find a copy at the publisher's website: https://www.redpillpress.com/shop/grand-deception-bill-browder-magnitsky-act-russian-sanctions/)
I listened to about the first half the other day but got distracted. I'm a bit skeptical that this is part of regime change in Israel--NOT that I doubt the US wants Netanyahu gone, but that this may not be connected. The overall US response appears to me to argue against that.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/10/israel-refutes-claims-provides-receipts-that-it-was/
from Jeff Childers -- fwiw
Day 11 — Middle East War Briefing. All major media sources are focused on the War in Israel and not much other news is getting through the noise.
💣 The “big news” yesterday was a hospital in in the middle of northern Gaza’s air raid zone blew up and a lot of people were killed and wounded. The Israelis had warned the hospital many times to evacuate, but it did not, not even after bombs fell all around it during previous air strikes, just as the Israelis had warned, nor did it evacuate its patients and staff even after the water and power was cut off.
It was just the opposite of evacuated. The hospital was packed with hundreds or even thousands of civilian noncombatants who were there, not for treatment, but for “shelter,” presumably trusting the Israelis not to bomb the hospital even after repeatedly warning the hospital could get bombed.
While the rubble was still burning, Hamas filmed horrifying shock videos of mangled bodies and scorched toys, and outraged pandemonium instantly ensued worldwide as people reacted angrily against Israel (for doing exactly what it said it would) with white-hot hot takes and violently jerking knees.
But then a twist appeared when, a few hours later, Israel published data and videos appearing to contradict the battle-hardened narrative.
Israel made the mistake of using logic instead of emotion. It claimed that, number one, it did not conduct any air strikes in that area of Gaza yesterday. Two, it reported Hamas launched 1,500 rockets toward Israel right down the block from the hospital, a few seconds before the explosion. Third, the IDF said 40% of Hamas rockets normally malfunction and often hit friendlies by accident. Fourth, at least three local videos, two released by Hamas, appear to show the Hamas rocket launch with one fireball returning to earth along with an explosion. Fifth, Israel claimed the Hamas rocket actually fell into the hospital parking lot, and video evidence appeared to support that claim.
Then later, while hardliners nitpicked the first five pieces of evidence, Israel released an audio intercept between two Hamas operatives who appeared to confirm the explosion was caused by a Hamas rocket. One can be heard explaining, “It seems that they fired this from the cemetery behind the hospital, then the way that it failed and it landed on the hospital.”
image 6.png
SOURCE: IDF audio intercept (gibberish with English transcript).
It is weird how the IDF intercepted this particular discussion but somehow missed all the discussions that might’ve warned them of the original Hamas attack, but I digress.
The developing story and Israel’s persuasive videos, argument, and audio caused newspaper editors’ heads to spin faster than John Fetterman hanging for dear life onto a whirling childrens’ merry-go-round. Here’s one great example: What would we do without the New York Times and its stealth editors? Behold, three papers in one day!
image 3.png
For what it’s worth, during his short visit yesterday, Joe Biden carefully* reviewed the evidence about the explosion and is siding with Israel. But of course, Biden mangled it, unaccountably referring to Hamas as “the other team,” as though the deadly conflict is some kind of sporting event:
(* results may vary)
image 2.png
CLIP: Biden languidly whispers deep sadness and outrage and sides with Israel (0:22).
Probably Biden just forgot Hamas’ name, and “the other team” remark was a sundowner technique to cover for the embarrassing gaffe.
Can you imagine poor Netanyahu having to smile through an entire meeting with Biden talking that slow? According to reports, the men met for “longer than expected,” which was just over an hour. I think we can agree the meeting was extended because Biden talked so slow and Bibi had to keep asking Joe’s handlers to explain what he just said.
To be clear: I take no position on who’s to blame for the hospital, because how could I? I don’t have access to the evidence. Neither does anybody else, and so nobody should be reacting emotionally (except perhaps over for the general tragedy of war). But at this point, Israel has presented a credible defense, and the burden of proof has shifted back to the Palestinians to prove that the explosion was not caused by one of their own rockets. They also need to explain why the hospital wasn’t reduced to a skeleton staff after the original Israeli evacuation warnings.
It’ll be a long, emotionally-exhausting war if everyone scrutinizes and argues over every single rocket strike and civilian casualty like this.
https://sonar21.com/israeli-bombing-of-baptist-hospital-intelligence-failure-or-deliberate/
I'm getting a "Forbidden: Access to this resource on the server is denied!" message when I try to open the link. Is anyone else getting this response? I've tried alternate browsers w/o success...
Yes. I just did. I read it a couple of hours ago and then got this. LJ has had some problems recently, nothing nefarious that I know of.
Looks like the Hospital "bombing" never happened. We all got snookered by a massive media-driven disinformation campaign. Hospital is still there, intact other than some broken windows. No impact crater. Damage to cars apparently from malfunctioning rocket that hit the parking lot.
https://redstate.com/bonchie/2023/10/18/update-shocking-evidence-shows-hamas-perpetrated-massive-disinformation-campaign-about-bombed-hospital-n2165213
Red State coverage has to be sifted carefully, same as their Russia coverage.
1. Lack of a crater would point toward a Hamas rocket--they're not that powerful.
2. In the very early part of the video it appears to me in the background that there's extensive damage to the hospital.
3. The parking lot damage would then be separate from the hospital.
Here's another take on the situation--CDR Salamander, extensively quoting Ayaan Hirsi Ali.
https://cdrsalamander.substack.com/p/ayaan-hirsi-ali-still-the-lioness?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=247761&post_id=138057525&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=9bg2k&utm_medium=email
It is also worth remembering, when you try to understand events in most of the world, that there are only two religions in the world that actually set any value on human life: Judaism and Christianity (and not all of their supposed adherents are always consistent about it. But Muslims set no value at all on the lives of non-Muslims, and in practice show little regard for even the lives of Muslims. And the Muslim teachings about the nature of Allah are extremely different from the Christian teachings about the nature of God.
Utter rubbish. The very first Buddhist precept is to refrain from taking the life of any living creature. Self-evidently this includes humans.
That's a ridiculous overgeneralization.
Incidentally, in the Bosnian conflict it was common practice by Muslim forces to commit mass civilian deaths in their own ranks for propaganda….just saying.
If the Saudis turn off the spigot then I’ll believe in a unified Islamic world.
They have turned down the flow. I've heard that will increase next year.
I’m very worried about Saudi / Gulf state funding of fundamentalist Islam worldwide.
This has moved Islam worldwide to be more conservative theough funding of Madrasses, Mosques, various “charities”, and even Sunni Jihadists.
It’s an elephant in the room the us ignores, because the Saudis and Gulf States are our Allies and fear of being accused of Islamaphobia. Not to mention their leverage due to oil.
I'm concerned about the spread of all false ideologies: jihadist, zionist, transhumanist, etc. The US funds most to all the worst false ideologies, as Putin recently pointed out.
Hubris seems a necessary precondition for the Fall.
"The Biden administration fears Israel has no real plan and the conflict may spiral unpredictably." I just woke my dog up laughing at that one. The Biden Regime is obviously speaking from experience. Concerning Jewish extremists, we always associated US Jews as being democrats. However, there is a significant group of extremists Jews in America too who are pushing this lunacy and the settlement movement. Eschatological indeed.
Caitlin Johnstone @caitoz
People should probably be more aware that according to United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, Israel hit this same hospital just a few days ago.
https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/attacks-health-care-israel-and-occupied-palestinian-territories-12-15-october-2023
Mark wrote:
"This is just the way things are. Carrier battle groups don’t deter the eschatological beliefs of either Jews or Muslims. Or Christians, for that matter. The inability of our rulers to wrap their heads around that is what people like Alistair Crooke term a “lack of empathy.” You can’t defuse a situation if you’re unable to get a “feel” for the worldview of the parties involved."
All absolutely true. Even worse, the people we are trying to bluff (or not) would be happy to have us drawn into this disaster.
Sigh, I wonder how much of this is a deliberate trap / setup by Biden’s Iranian Buddies…
I just found out the US is funding the Lebanese Army, $72 million.
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/israel-middle-east/articles/biden-administration-tries-hide-knew-impending-massacre-leaving-iran-untouched-hamas-lee-smith
Whatever the neocons do, Ray, it will be a colossal screw-up. All we can do is protect ourselves and our families until the crazed elephants lumber off the scene.
Unbelievable and disgraceful - all of it.
It's a legit perspective, although it seems crazy even from that perspective.
Meaning, it seems crazy even from a Neocon perspective.
I have refrained from commenting on this whole onset of war between Israel and Hamas over the last week because of my own lack of time, lack of specific knowledge of background and events, and because these issues and questions are so politically and emotionally charged. Also, the rule of waiting to see what shakes out is a good one. Thank you Mark for your courageous endeavors to throw light on this situation as it has unfolded and also I appreciate as always the many insightful comments put forward by this community.
All that said, with the vortex of escalation we seem to be in amidst the known knowns, the known unknowns, and the unknown unknowns that persist, I think I can reasonably state the following:
1) No one seems to want peace or de-escalation. The U.S. state department has instructed its people to refrain from using such language in their statements. Also:
"A series of statements from multiple sides point toward continued escalation, which could explode well beyond the Gaza crisis:
* Israel Ministry of Health: "The war may last a long time, prepare an emergency stock of food for 4 months."
* Iranian Foreign Minister: "The expansion of the war to other fronts has begun to reach unavoidable stages."
* IDF Spokesman: "Israel is prepared on its own both in the north and in the south."
* Israeli Military Spokesman: "If Hezbollah commits a grave mistake, we will respond with devastating force never seen before." (https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/israel-evacuates-residents-28-towns-near-lebanese-border-hezbollah-attacks-increase)
2) That the IDF would not be in position to prevent the initial Hamas attack on Oct 7 beggars belief. So either someone in the IDF or someone with authority over the IDF must be held responsible for that situation, along with Hamas. Israel has said they are "looking into it." Will we ever hear who was responsible for such gross negligence? What if it was purposeful rather than negligent? In this regard, thank you to the several commenters who linked to the Efrat Fennigson / Bret Weinstein interview (https://rumble.com/v3oewxb-the-israel-attacks-beyond-the-obvious-with-efrat-fenigson.html).
3) One would have to think that purposefully bombing a hospital in Gaza would in ordinary circumstances be an amazing act of evil and stupidity if done by Israel. It effectively sabotaged Biden's trip (Jordan and Palestine have already cancelled out) and put the U.S. in an incredibly difficult diplomatic position vis-a-vis Israel and the ME as a whole. That is, unless someone in the Israeli government or military WANTS all out war and believes Israel can win one. On the other hand of course, Hamas (and Iran) would have ample incentive for doing this to totally cut off Israel from the world's sympathy and the U.S.'s aid.
4) Regardless of the whos and whats and whys of all this, in the end Russia, China, and the BRICs will benefit from this conflict in the long term, and the U.S. and Israel will be damaged by it.
5) I am waiting to see where the "cooler heads" who might prevail come from. It should be a pretty simple process of elimination when you subtract those who consistently promote peace through their words and actions from those who do not.
At the UN Security Council, The US and its Western allies all vetoed the Cease fire proposal resolution submitted by Russia🙄
By tomorrow morning you’re going to find that it was clearly a hamas rocket and not an Israeli bomb.
That or climate change.
One of analyses cited by Israel was an outfit that claimed a Hamas rocket blew up in the air and that part of it fell on the hospital. That's another very weak non-explanation. So far I haven't been wrong about the propaganda. If this is the first, then so be it. The point that I'll make if that does happen is that it was accidental and not deliberate, like the Israeli bombardment that has killed thousands and injured many thousands more.
https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-768879
One of the reports I saw was that there were multiple explosions--the original rocket or whatever that set it off, and then explosions from the building itself. Hamas has a long record of using civilian sites for its activities, and possibly for munitions storage. And this would not be the first time one of their rocket attacks killed their own people; I have seen reports of that happening for several years.
And/ or fuel storage
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/spencerbrown/2023/10/17/did-hamas-rocket-misfire-just-take-out-a-hospital-in-gaza-city-n2629969
According to this report on Townhall, the rockets were set off by Islamic Jihad, not Hamas.
One thing I have been hearing for years is, when some event happens, don't jump to conclusions instantly--wait for a bit. I think that principle applies here.
The Al Jazeera video captured it. They stopped the video right after it hit. With the damage claimed, it would need to be bigger than the usual missile warhead, unless their was a secondary explosion. Disclaimer - May be it was a super large missile with a warhead big enough to do the damage, but those have not been used by the Palestinian side yet.
A bigger issue is it may not matter who’s at fault, if the Arab World believes Israel did it.
I've seen reports that specifically state that there were NO secondary explosions.
@Frank
Slightly OT: I've just finished reading Grand Deception, Alex Krainer's tour de force takedown of Bill Browder, the Harvard Boys and the Neocon obsession with destroying Russia. I must say I will listen to Alex Krainer even more carefully than I might otherwise have with the Grand Deception in the back of my mind. I strongly recommend it. (If you can find it...its banned on Amazon but I managed to find a copy at the publisher's website: https://www.redpillpress.com/shop/grand-deception-bill-browder-magnitsky-act-russian-sanctions/)
I listened to about the first half the other day but got distracted. I'm a bit skeptical that this is part of regime change in Israel--NOT that I doubt the US wants Netanyahu gone, but that this may not be connected. The overall US response appears to me to argue against that.