49 Comments
User's avatar
NFO's avatar

When I saw the word "Vietnamization" in the title, I felt a little spark of hope by reading that term the later, Nixonian sense of handing the mess over to the locals to fight their own battles. Alas, no such luck...crazies are doubling down.

Expand full comment
Mark Wauck's avatar

That's my fear.

Expand full comment
Ray-SoCa's avatar

Afghanistan, Iraq, Vietnam, Pakistan, and Ukraine were all among the most corrupt Countries when the US was involved in an armed conflict.

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

Wow! Looks like we're heading for a massive pile-up of speeding juggernauts here. And with us in the middle. Not much to add to all the points made, except what the heck were the neocons thinking? If I, an ordinary Joe, can see that sanctions would never work against Russia, why couldn't they? Unbelievable.

Expand full comment
Cosmo T Kat's avatar

The chosen people are above criticism and this is why NEOCONS never reflect on their ideological and geopolitical errors. It's about the money.....always. The Crooke article nails it on the head. They cannot make a course correction that would be admitting they were wrong and their strategy failing, but the money rolls in anyway.

Expand full comment
Hal's avatar

Great comments on a great post. Everything sent to Ukraine has been consumed by the war with Russia. We have allowed difficult to replace military equipment to be destroyed IN DETAIL by the Russians. Either by overwhelming firepower or superior technology and often both. Sending very good tanks will be the same. Russian Air and artillery will wipe them out just as our air power did to the Germans when we had air dominance in WW2 Europe. After a bunch of Irreplaceable(?) Abrams are destroyed because the Russians have air supremacy the next escalation called for will be for us to ‘close the sky.’ Tanks without support are targets and the Russkies would love to show the world that the mighty Abrams tank can burn just like any other tank. Will we send the few F22’s that we have to contest the airspace? I mean those not damaged or destroyed by a hurricane that apparently sprang out of nowhere. Is an Air Force that can’t protect a precious asset like the F22 from THE WEATHER capable of dealing with Russian air defense? What is Air Force readiness like these days? Better than the Russian Air Force? Better than Aeroflot? Are they still flying baby formula around or have we figured out how to feed the babies again? Basic things that used to work do not and as described in the linked Crooke article we now have the big reveal. We are strip mining artillery ammunition from around the world to keep Ukraine from collapsing. NATO countries are sending ALL of their artillery to Ukraine to replace those destroyed by superior Russian counter-battery fire. How much artillery do the Russians have in storage? It will take years to replace the ammunition and guns already consumed. Is anyone discussing the need to go to a war footing? Are we sleepwalking/sundowning into a great power war? Apparently we have forgotten how terrible it is. I am concerned that we will start this war with fewer weapons and that we will be surprised at how good the enemy’s technology is. A F-117 was shot down and they were put into storage in the 90’s. Obsolete? Is stealth really that good? Good enough to ‘close the sky?’ I am afraid we will find out. One last thought: removing weapons and ammunition from stockpiles around the world sends a signal to our enemies and our friends. The cupboard is bare. What happens if our enemies make a coordinated move? Which friend to help first? Will we still have any or will they make the necessary accommodations in light of their permanent interests?

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

Hello Hal (very good points!) This comment, Cassander's that follows it & others remind me 'winning' has been redefined, apparently: i.e. our Military/Industrial war machine-complex has made many billionaires and wrought much destruction - particularly of Human lives. Wars won? Hmmm, I don't see anything positive on that scorecard.

What-if what seems plainly dangerous to all the Western World's security - the consumption of munitions, equipment etc., is part of the Cabal's Ideological plan - much like the Int'l Reserve banking financial insanity? Pair the inability to actually fight, (with an actual deserved foe) with the crumbling economies under the failing US hegemony financially.... let's toss in the massive inability to produce stuff (Hmmm, China...) and an unexpected aside but, relevant I think, an ideologically 'non' educated younger populace here in the US (imagine drawing a WW fighting force from the wokester generations!) and the resulting mix brings... (words fail me here. Plus that is 1 sentence and proves why I'm not an author of anything! English/English comp was NOT my strong suit, ever).

Okay, my head is spinning. These subjections, coupled with your points of actual logistical inventory / production ability reductions would never be acceptable to real, 'Save Democracy' planners. Or non-wartime basic national defense planners. Or any reasonable planners.

Are we to believe our "Int'l alliance" is simply stupid? I don't think it is. There IS a lot of stupid, of course, and the foisting of Biden on us demonstrates that. But I'm inclined to go with nefarious.

Often spoken is 'if you wanted to ruin XXXX, you'd do it this way' about lots of stuff. That quaint axiom may actually apply. The present situations are wrought with devastating consequences, which to boil it down a bit, will come down on we common-people who populate this planet paying the price and suffering the consequences.

I do mean to expressly note this particular posting of Marks' is bringing to light and our considered thoughts a huge concern and I see, growing awareness. These are not just dangerous times, they may be engineered destructive times. That begins to sound very much like a 'conspiracy theory' and it's no accident the left/progressives have attacked every concern against bad things as conspiracy theories of the 'Right' no matter how reasonable, or actual (ala Twitter...) they are.

I always wonder, near the end of my internal rants, what can I actually do about this? My lack of trust now in the American Way leaves me with nothin'. THAT is fatalistic and not my way: however I also hate acting out of desperation. And to conclude (too many) my comments; I do not like 'swirling the drain'. I choose NOT to live like that. (My best regards, Hal. WRH)

Expand full comment
Hal's avatar

Mr. Hovland thank you for your kind response. Conspiracy or idiocy? How about useful idiocy? I think idiocy on the most part. Most of us, myself included, are not of the profession of arms and can never know the horror of war. So ignorance plays a part, both from lack of experience and lack of true education. The education deficiency is deliberate. Leadership desirous of a subordinated population never allows true education to happen. How hard is it to turn Afghanistan into Indiana? Perhaps historical knowledge regarding our own post-Civil War Reconstruction would teach how hard it is to impose one’s will even after military victory. Is this studied in depth in schools across the land? We also have the structure of the all volunteer military. All credit to those who volunteer. They are the best of us. But the other side of that coin is that, per GW Bush, the rest of us just need to shop. We have no skin in the game unless we know someone in the service. This liberated ‘leadership’ from having the entire population giving a hard look at what they are up to with the military and foreign policy. Education and the lack of universal military service are just two of the pieces that create the structure that we see today. The are related because a true civic education would lead to universal service as part of citizenship. These are just a few of the changes made to our society over the past few decades.

One could certainly look at what is being done in foreign affairs and conclude that there is a faction that wants to do away with the post WW2 order. They are called globalists. Is unsustainable war an adaptation of the Cloward/Piven socialist strategy to bankrupt us and wreck our economy? All for the purpose of bringing about heaven on Earth also known as socialism.

Kindest Regards,

Hal

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

Hello and thank you Hal. Your comments show deep, thoughtful reflection that I suspect many who read it will share with me a nodding-head of agreement.

I am just old enough to remember President JF Kennedy. I didn't even know politics existed when he took office. I do remember being devastated at his assassination. I remember loving my country, that the President was a hero to a suburban-growing little boy. Just 7 years old I began a patriotic belief in this country - that in a school of about 500 elementary-aged kids was taught as being God fearing, World respected, honorable and worthy to be proud of.

Military has been a part of my family heritage. Up through my generation at least. My immediate family served proudly, expecting nothing except having the honor and privilege to serve. My cousin, raised with me and my siblings, gave his life in Viet Nam. In 2011 I was able to touch his engraved name at the Washington DC memorial honoring lost veterans of that conflict. As I cried I was proud to be an American. I am proud that my mom, dad, brother and I have been allowed to have served in our armed forces - 86 years all told. I also do believe I am not owed anything, I am the recipient of the blessing of being an American and there is no way I could repay that.

If I may return to President JFK memory for one more item. He was instrumental in what may be remembered these days as the Peace Corps. His desire was that all would have a venue to serve this country. USA's participation in Viet Nam was still mostly advisors, making Korea the last 'War' requiring our troops in larger numbers. So the foundation of Serving our country he recognized as very important. At that time, women were not even considered for combat roles and many men simply had reasons for not choosing military service - the Peace Corps provided enormous opportunity to serve -not just our country but also across the world. That was a time when Peace was absolutely valued above conflict.

That being said, military functioning has become an industry with boundless clientele. Sadly, the bulk of our populace has no say or choice and are always the payees. In money/cost and in blood/life. Necessary evil is what it seems to have devolved into. Amazing technology developed by war and was even put to good, civil usage however, the Space Race to the Moon produced that without requiring death for fuel to develop it.

Can it be we might return to such a non-military oriented culture?

I find great strength, peace and assurance in my Faith, Hal. Not as an 'opiate' but fulfilling what I believe is the Creator's desires for His creation. While answers about where mankind is at or where it is going aren't answered specifically for me, what has become truth is the spiritual nature of man is fully in play with the denial of said nature being fore-front in most (or all?) of the stuff that is so wrong. The Truth really isn't symbolic or only as defined/accepted by human kind. There simply is Truth that I've found great consolation in by my Faith.

Blessings Sir. If you've made it through my (sadly normal) long comment thank you. Respectfully, WRH (Idaho)

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

Here in Euro fantasy land, the MSM is talking about the tanks being a game changer. According to my local rag, those 200 Leopards will stop a Russian drive towards Moscow. Oh, and the Russians are suffering massive losses. The awakening will be brutal.

Expand full comment
Bash's avatar

When Obama said "never underestimate Joe's ability to f-things up", I never thought he would manage to be so incompetent that he would precipitate the end of the US Dollar as the global fiat currency

Few people understand that a good portion of American national wealth and power is built on this - the reason why US national debt doesn't matter is because of dollar supremacy. Take that away, take away the endless demand for dollars from other nations, and suddenly you have to balance the books again. That means no more trillion dollar military. No more ridiculous spending.

A good example - China does the vast majority of its export business in USD. To anywhere. Thailand buying some plastic goods? USD. That currency typically gets recycled back to NY as long term T-bills. Incidentally this is why One Belt One Road scared a lot of (smart) people, the Chinese started spending their money rather than sending it back

Getting into a war with Russia makes no sense on any level. To this day, I do not understand the US (or UK) national interest in taking this stance in the conflict

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

Hello Mr. Bash,

This posting of Marks is aging but I could not resist responding to your comment...

1) I wonder (before rhetorically, now, actually) if the demise of the USD is intentional. Mark has shared Luongo's belief the Fed is in a war with European $ powers, which makes it appear such a demise is being resisted (by Powell) and conflicts within the 'unseen & unelected forces' behind the scenes are at odds... (i.e. the Cabal vs. Fed w/ NY bankers, etc.). Aside, that power struggle may be an unintended saving-grace for the US... one can hope!

& 2) RE: Obama's (factual) note on Biden's 'ability'... I think Mr. Obama is only taken back when Biden screws up HIS nefarious plans (which F-things up all by themselves). A Wheel within a Wheel: Biden is screwing up Obama's programs of screwing stuff up..

I hope you get a chuckle from this and that you have a great day! (WRH)

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

I may be bigoted! Maybe it should be Ms. Bash? (Prejudiced and dumb - having to deal with today's gender-awareness culture!) No slight intended, tho'!

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

Quite a stunning set of events, truly challenging to find historical precedence. Mark has a good point with the coup in 'Nam reminder. It appears many of our 'betters', mostly 'behind the scenes', are in competition for directing the Wests' path forward. The best I can do is see that competition for power, for ideological outcomes, for what seem mad-world controlling outcomes is finding a battlefield in Ukraine. And, I'll suggest, is a losing proposition all-around.

My tendency is to look back in history seeking some understanding. I will have to commend the many, well considered thoughts shared tonight but find strong agreement with Ms. Amanda's statement of looking at the info Mark shared again tomorrow with a fresh set of eyes...

For the moment I can not separate our 'President' and his ails from the Neocon Kagan's beliefs of never-ending global 'forward-motion', claims of necessity therein for 'civic bonds of domestic unity' and the well considered Luongo 'Theory of Everything'.

At best I see the Ukraine battlefield a focal point of the broader 'New World Order' intentions that has many designers competing for their ideals to be the model. None of which, as I can see, include the wishes of the populace of said world to subject to the New Order. Is it possible it's all interconnected?

Running 'Biden' worked to give the presidency over to 'the dark side'; so just what was the Hitler-esque speech depicting 1/2 of American voters neo-fascists really about? The election happened: millions of 'student loan repayments' were promised [I think being unlawful] and political Hi-jinx abounded. Lots of unexplained, perhaps unexplainable cr@p went on. And goes on. To what end?

Our founding fathers made very clear our country was to not be involved internationally without absolute necessity. Trade? Necessary. Border regulations? Yes. War? Not unless absolutely necessary - to be avoided if at all possible. Yet, Wars are the common, historical thread since WWII.

BTW, which wars, of several, has the USofA won since WWII? I guess winners are not necessarily defined like they used to be. Billionaires abound resulting from the dreaded Military/Industrial complex President Ike strongly warned against. They seem to be winners. I'll suggest hundreds of millions of deceased or ruined lives might not find much winning in all of that, however.

I did get a chuckle from Mark's posting from the Babylon Bee: I guess I'll have to make some trips to the thrift store just to look for my own supply! Blessings to all! (WRH)

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

Morning, Wayne. Good to hear from you as usual! The Babylon Bee always nails it - and adds a bit of much needed humour to this scary situation. I was cleaning about a chest of drawers yesterday and stumbled across an old photo of the ship I served on way back in the 80s. Better get rid of it before the FBI bust in here and accuse me of having classified docs! Crazy times!

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

G'day S'21 and likewise, good to hear from you. Thanks for your note: in our 2-tierd justice system your pic may show a secret Radar Dome from 40 years ago and technically a Felony. Of course, simple insurance from prosecution is to contribute a bunch of $'s to the dems... their rules are 'different'... Plus you know that while I jest pretty innocent men went to jail for pics that showed nothing BUT were taken on a restricted vessel. Some may still be in. Weird times! Best to you, Sir! (WRH)

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

I'm sure the Neocon's "gamed" this out at last years Aspen institute conference.

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

And what of the recent 3 stooges visit to Kiev too... two-bit Graham, Blumenhead, and Whitehorse?

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

And McCarthy heading for Taiwan soon. It's like they want nuclear war.

Expand full comment
Mark Wauck's avatar

Very disappointing. But it confirms in its way what Crooke was saying about the necessarily expansionist nature of our empire, built on financialization.

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

And on Wednesday Zhou to announce that Abrams tanks are now in play...

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

The Russians must be killing themselves laughing. The Abrams used high powered turbine engines that give off a massive heat profile. Easy targets.

Expand full comment
perle's avatar

Thank you for this crucial examintion of our current exissential crisis, and the articles referenced. Ponzi seems to be the order of the day. Ponzi schemes always collapse. I question the emphasis on the Ukraine, although that could be the 'Black Swan' that brings it all crashing down. Is it Crooke or Kagan who stated that without expansion "civic bonds of domestic unity come into question." Any bonds of domestic unity have been totally destroyed by the actions of our government against its citizens these past years. The contempt shown us 'deplorables', the end of the rule of law and a trusted electoral process and the existence of an open border where anybody can come in and be treated better than we the citizens have destroyed all trust in government. I would even suggest that ignoring the world, shoring up our domestic economy and improving the lives of the citizens would be more productive than foreign adventurism and would do more to shore up the dollar as well.

Expand full comment
Ray-SoCa's avatar

I just don't see this:

>expansionary republican greatness

Our elites seem to want it due to the grift involved. And a lot of the associated NGO's have children of the elites working for them. And probably, they get US funding for their mission, support Democratic Leaning Employees, and some of the money gets funneled back to the DNC.

Expand full comment
Joseph Kaplan's avatar

You got it

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

Agreed, don't forget the vast Defense companies (Lockheed, Raytheon, Boeng, etc.) and there "kin"... Grift all around.

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

One does have to wonder how it is our 'Defense Contractors' can sell to both sides of a conflict... oh yeah, it's not about doing what's right but profit. And they build debacles like the F35... said to be superior... well after a bunch are shot down/destroyed I kind of wonder how that ol' American Manufacturing capability will work out on replacements... (quoting my grandkids "just sayin'"... ----- :^) ----- (WRH)

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Jan 25, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
Cosmo T Kat's avatar

Every time you turn around there is a NEOCON presence in all the grift taking place. NEOCON and patriot are not synonymous it is $$$ and revenge that animates their interests. A more equitable, peaceful and better world is only rhetoric acting to cover for their malfeasance.

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

Amongst all the fog and unknowns, reliably there will be major grift. I will suggest, Ray, that grift is a tool not necessarily the objective. Sometimes a by-product, too, with the loser-gov't connected folk lying in wait. (My best to you! WRH)

Expand full comment
Amanda R's avatar

I'm going to re read this tomorrow with fresh eyes but a quick update from U.K: Bojo called for Ukr to be given NATO membership straight away and Germany has finally agreed to allow Poland to ship Leopard tanks so things are sounding desperate.

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

Funny how BoJo is suddenly Ambassador Without Portfolio, jetting off to Kiev to sort things out and hand out pep talks. Who gave him this authority?

Expand full comment
Amanda R's avatar

Word on the street is Bojo is working against Sunak and a coup plot is underway to re-install him as PM. This trip has been reported as a way to undermine Sunak. Complete farce.

Expand full comment
Steghorn21's avatar

Hello Amanda. Well, at least Sunak knows how to use a comb!

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

Does Turkey as a member of NATO not have some say in this? Oh wait, ask Sweden and Finland.

Expand full comment
Joseph Kaplan's avatar

Does the congress?

Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

This posting requires that Fresh Eyes revisit. Note the interview w/Mercouris noted a prospect that it is Poland that will wind up with the modern tanks rather than they be consumed in the ongoing Ukraine debacle. I don't necessarily agree but (sadly) it makes sense, as presented. Best wishes, Ms. Amana! (WRH)

Expand full comment
susan mullen's avatar

Neocon Robert Kagan freely admits in 2021 that endless US foreign aggression is needed to keep US citizens in line at home: "He [Kagan] thus asserts that the U.S. empire abroad is required – precisely in order to preserve the myth of ‘democracy’ at home. An America that retreats from global hegemony, he argues, would no longer possess the cohesive binding to preserve America as liberal democracy, at home either."" ...Alastair Crooke, March 15, 2021...https://strategic-culture.org/news/2021/03/15/leviathan-mobilises-for-decisive-battle/...Robert Kagan, Foreign Affairs, March/April 2021, "A Superpower, Like It or Not

Why Americans Must Accept Their Global Role."...https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/united-states/2021-02-16/superpower-it-or-not

Expand full comment
D Burlin's avatar

The US govt has known from Day One that Zelensky is neck deep in oligarch theft. This is the man who is an expert in propaganda which he has deployed to his advantage in the Western world. It has been surreal to see the comparisons to Churchill, as he and his wife take time out to do a glossy photo shoot for Vanity Fair and leave the war zone to attend the Cannes Film Festival--where he received a standing ovation. Ukraine was the money-laundering capital of the world. Not sure that has changed. The man is stuffing his pockets.

Expand full comment
ML's avatar

and he’s now being schooled that the CIA has “six ways from Sunday” to take him down. Tx for all your insights and analysis Mark. All fits.

Expand full comment
Joseph Kaplan's avatar

Do you think he’s going to live long enough to enjoy it? Or is he about to do a mousolini exit? (I never tried to spell that Italian guy before. Doesn’t look right but y’all get the drift)

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

This war is a 3 Act play. We are now entering Act 2.

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Jan 25, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
WayneRH's avatar

Hello F.I.L., thank you sir - I really appreciate your thought provoking comments. My best to you! (WRH)

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Jan 24, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
Joseph Kaplan's avatar

I think you hit the core of the matter.

Expand full comment
AmericanCardigan's avatar

Hhhmm.. think we hit the debt ceiling just the other day. Oh and by the way, Mitch is close friends with Bill Kristol.

Expand full comment
Cosmo T Kat's avatar

Birds of grifting feathers always flock together.

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Jan 25, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
Cosmo T Kat's avatar

Well said.

Expand full comment