I don’t make a study of mass shootings. Like certain other criminal acts, it’s an unpleasant topic that I tend to avoid thinking about. However, I have seen in the past that virtually all such killers are either users of illegal drugs or, perhaps more commonly, are on prescription meds. I’ve seen arguments both ways as to cause and effect or no connection at all. What appears to be true is that this aspect is rarely mentioned in the reporting. The Left—which seems to have a vested interest in meds—wants to talk about guns, while the Right is reflexively preoccupied with defending the Second Amendment.
Obviously screaming at people to charge someone with a gun is tough. LE don't get paid to commit suicide--you need a plan. OTOH, an hour and a half is a long time.
The AP is reporting from an anecdotal report that it was 40 minutes. Estimating time in a situation like this is tricky and often biased toward the point that the person - a neighbor across the street from the school - is trying to make after the fact.
Re my comment yesterday, where I speculated Ramos’s plan may not have included the school, reports today indicate that he did intend to shoot up a school. Not necessarily that one. He is believed to have sent social media messages about shooting his grandmother and going to shoot up a school. Now they must investigate those to see if he was actually the sender. The internet is full of nuts and malicious persons.
40 minutes is still a very long time when someone is pulling a trigger. Many jurisdictions have removed police/security personnel from schools, removed their firearms, replaced them with stickers on the doors. A lot of that happened after St. George Floyd ODed.
Five or ten minutes are too long. But this little school in this little town was clearly blindsided by what happened. Like many elementary schools - at least in the West - it appears to be an open plan rather than a building with a central entrance and interior hallways. If that is the case, all of the school rooms’ doors open onto outdoor corridors. Per fire and other safety regulations, they cannot be locked.
I heard that there were guards at the school. Reportedly one exchanged fire with Ramos. We will find out more about whether that is true as we go along. Because of the internet, we want to know now if not sooner, right?
I'll see you this piece by Berenson and raise you the one that he put up immediately after. The kid was a marijuana user. I told a friend of mine over dinner yesterday evening that he would prove to be a drug user.
I hope that the left and the right can agree that randomly killing innocent people is rooted in mental illness. The potential causes of mental illness is partly what makes addressing it so challenging. Genetic predispositions, environmental factors and trauma are some of the more common predictors. Adding drugs to the mix (pharmaceutical, recreational, legal and illegal) complicates matters ten-fold. Of course, you can always have substance induced mental illness, the symptoms of which will vary greatly depending on the drug of choice and length of use.
While there are exceptions, mass shooters trend more toward males between 17-25 years old. This would lead me in the direction of a true mental illness, possibly exacerbated by drug use as opposed to a mental illness caused by substance use alone. More than likely, educators have shared abnormal behavioral concerns with parents/guardians early and often only to be met with excuses and/or blame which delays effective interventions.
Sadly, this is undeniable. I retired from public education in 2019. I was a school counselor for 28 years. I work at a private Catholic school now. We are vigilant when it comes to curriculum review, but that is not enough. We have to engage in uncomfortable conversations with parents early and often. It is hard for a parent to hear that their child has abnormal and/or antisocial behavior.
I understand. One of my sisters was a school psychologist in mostly lower income urban schools, another taught in a private Catholic school, and my wife worked in the front office of a private school for 27 years. Oh, my father was a psychology professor. It seems to be in the blood.
"the sick feeling I had dropping my kids off this morning. Hug my six-year-old extra tight in case some devil with a hankering to destroy children exercises his constitutional right to walk out of the local gun store locked and loaded."
Sorry, Alex. If you really fear for the safety of your child in this way you have no business dropping them off at that school. The public schools have ceased being a rational choice for children, at least in many places.
There is a higher correlation between fatherlessness and mass murder than there is with drug use. At root, this is an effect destroying the two parent family.
In the early hours when little is known about these shootings and those who perpetrate them the internet forums go wild. Because few have understanding of unhappy young misfits, that legitimate cause tends go get shoved under the rug. Whatever, no one wants wo wait for more information.
Drugs - prescribed and illicit - are speculated about.
I have a hunch, based on various reports, that something else may have been going on here. Ramos was rumored to have been “bullied” in high school. He had a speech impediment. He was from a poor family. He dressed funny. And on and on. Some wonder where this “poor” kid got enough money to buy those weapons and ammo. Wendy’s? They don’t make much there. He didn’t have a driver’s license, but crashed a vehicle he was driving into a paved roadside frainage ditch near this elementary school while being chased by the Border Patrol. Why would they have pursued him after he shot his grandmother? Why not local law enforcement? (He was a citizen, born in North Dakota.) Will missing pieces come out about some activity he was engaged in at the nearby borderf. Did he really intend to target that school or was it just the nearest refuge after he crashed? Many possibilities.
As for the drugs, recreational marijuana users poohpooh it, but as I recall, there can be a link between marijuana use and schizophrenia in young men in their late teens/early 20s.
My point? As with many bizarre crimes, we may never know what caused Ramos to do this. We will not find out right away - that is a pretty sure thing.
Just a few thoughts based on early reports. Forgive typos…neuropathy in hands.
For what it’s worth, Berenson is right with you regarding Marijuana. See his book: “Tell Your Children: The Truth About Marijuana, Mental Illness, and Violence.”
I don't believe the problem is the stimulant meds themselves, we have something like 50 years of use for those that need them,, but there are many other over prescribed and poorly monitored drugs such as SSRI's that don't play well with adolescents.
There may be issues with drugs given for depression, that can have suicidal side effects. They can increase anxiety. I have a gut feelings, there is a bit of protectiveness by drug makers using lawyers, to make sure the issue is minimized.
Drugs were seen at one time as the answer / cure for psychiatric issues, which is why the mental hospitals were closed down. Unfortunately that was not true.
And creating school environments that are toxic, that force male children to act like females, and removing PE / Physical Activity, is going to result in boys over medicated due to Attention Deficit Order.
Book Review at City Journal.
Soul Doctors
A new book takes an unsparing look at psychiatry's past and future.
Ray, as more info comes out it seems he had only lived with his grandmother for the last few months. Photos of his family show a pretty civilized-looking bunch.
CTD, an astonishing amount of ignorance about ADD and treatments for it on the internet. When some are looking for something to blame, they often grab something of which they have no understanding. And pass it on.
That is exactly what an old school friend of mine who went on to become an internationally recognized child psychologist advocated. She specialized in reading, developed her own program, wrote numerous books, and was considered an authority on teaching children to read, but she also had strong opinions about ADD/ADHD. She said young boys needed just what you have described.
I don't think its pot. But kids are pumped full of drugs. A kid needs to burn off energy and if you're not letting them run free at times then using medication to control the energy you're hurting them.
Then they pump these kids full of doom and gloom and confusing ideologies to the point were they need anti-depressants. I guarantee this is the problem.
Yes, meth and crack are bad too. But this is long term psychological problems cause by tyrannical people who care more to control the world then to raise healthy well adjusted people.
between a school district where a vocal minority of parents are tagged as suspected domestic terrorists trying to interfere with programs meant to fundamentally transform society... and a school district where the vast majority of parents are transparently understood to need free daycare and therefore see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.
You can have parent participation in raising children, or you can have free daycare, but not both, not really? cf Chicago Public Schools
Obviously screaming at people to charge someone with a gun is tough. LE don't get paid to commit suicide--you need a plan. OTOH, an hour and a half is a long time.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10855093/Furious-father-Texas-school-shooting-victim-slams-police-failing-stop-gunman-HOUR.html
The AP is reporting from an anecdotal report that it was 40 minutes. Estimating time in a situation like this is tricky and often biased toward the point that the person - a neighbor across the street from the school - is trying to make after the fact.
Re my comment yesterday, where I speculated Ramos’s plan may not have included the school, reports today indicate that he did intend to shoot up a school. Not necessarily that one. He is believed to have sent social media messages about shooting his grandmother and going to shoot up a school. Now they must investigate those to see if he was actually the sender. The internet is full of nuts and malicious persons.
40 minutes is still a very long time when someone is pulling a trigger. Many jurisdictions have removed police/security personnel from schools, removed their firearms, replaced them with stickers on the doors. A lot of that happened after St. George Floyd ODed.
Five or ten minutes are too long. But this little school in this little town was clearly blindsided by what happened. Like many elementary schools - at least in the West - it appears to be an open plan rather than a building with a central entrance and interior hallways. If that is the case, all of the school rooms’ doors open onto outdoor corridors. Per fire and other safety regulations, they cannot be locked.
I heard that there were guards at the school. Reportedly one exchanged fire with Ramos. We will find out more about whether that is true as we go along. Because of the internet, we want to know now if not sooner, right?
I'll see you this piece by Berenson and raise you the one that he put up immediately after. The kid was a marijuana user. I told a friend of mine over dinner yesterday evening that he would prove to be a drug user.
Ah!
I hope that the left and the right can agree that randomly killing innocent people is rooted in mental illness. The potential causes of mental illness is partly what makes addressing it so challenging. Genetic predispositions, environmental factors and trauma are some of the more common predictors. Adding drugs to the mix (pharmaceutical, recreational, legal and illegal) complicates matters ten-fold. Of course, you can always have substance induced mental illness, the symptoms of which will vary greatly depending on the drug of choice and length of use.
While there are exceptions, mass shooters trend more toward males between 17-25 years old. This would lead me in the direction of a true mental illness, possibly exacerbated by drug use as opposed to a mental illness caused by substance use alone. More than likely, educators have shared abnormal behavioral concerns with parents/guardians early and often only to be met with excuses and/or blame which delays effective interventions.
My apologies for the long comment.
Nowadays, more than likely educators seem to enable abnormal behavior without sharing any concerns with parents/guardians.
Sadly, this is undeniable. I retired from public education in 2019. I was a school counselor for 28 years. I work at a private Catholic school now. We are vigilant when it comes to curriculum review, but that is not enough. We have to engage in uncomfortable conversations with parents early and often. It is hard for a parent to hear that their child has abnormal and/or antisocial behavior.
I understand. One of my sisters was a school psychologist in mostly lower income urban schools, another taught in a private Catholic school, and my wife worked in the front office of a private school for 27 years. Oh, my father was a psychology professor. It seems to be in the blood.
"the sick feeling I had dropping my kids off this morning. Hug my six-year-old extra tight in case some devil with a hankering to destroy children exercises his constitutional right to walk out of the local gun store locked and loaded."
Sorry, Alex. If you really fear for the safety of your child in this way you have no business dropping them off at that school. The public schools have ceased being a rational choice for children, at least in many places.
Yes.
There is a higher correlation between fatherlessness and mass murder than there is with drug use. At root, this is an effect destroying the two parent family.
https://www.heritage.org/marriage-and-family/commentary/the-crisis-fatherless-shooters
In the early hours when little is known about these shootings and those who perpetrate them the internet forums go wild. Because few have understanding of unhappy young misfits, that legitimate cause tends go get shoved under the rug. Whatever, no one wants wo wait for more information.
Drugs - prescribed and illicit - are speculated about.
I have a hunch, based on various reports, that something else may have been going on here. Ramos was rumored to have been “bullied” in high school. He had a speech impediment. He was from a poor family. He dressed funny. And on and on. Some wonder where this “poor” kid got enough money to buy those weapons and ammo. Wendy’s? They don’t make much there. He didn’t have a driver’s license, but crashed a vehicle he was driving into a paved roadside frainage ditch near this elementary school while being chased by the Border Patrol. Why would they have pursued him after he shot his grandmother? Why not local law enforcement? (He was a citizen, born in North Dakota.) Will missing pieces come out about some activity he was engaged in at the nearby borderf. Did he really intend to target that school or was it just the nearest refuge after he crashed? Many possibilities.
As for the drugs, recreational marijuana users poohpooh it, but as I recall, there can be a link between marijuana use and schizophrenia in young men in their late teens/early 20s.
My point? As with many bizarre crimes, we may never know what caused Ramos to do this. We will not find out right away - that is a pretty sure thing.
Just a few thoughts based on early reports. Forgive typos…neuropathy in hands.
Meds coupled with video games.
maybe some heavy metal music /sarc
where is personal responsibility?
For what it’s worth, Berenson is right with you regarding Marijuana. See his book: “Tell Your Children: The Truth About Marijuana, Mental Illness, and Violence.”
Ah, thanks!
Marijuana often can increase the sense of alienation and paranoia.
It’s a shame this is not discussed more.
I don't believe the problem is the stimulant meds themselves, we have something like 50 years of use for those that need them,, but there are many other over prescribed and poorly monitored drugs such as SSRI's that don't play well with adolescents.
There may be issues with drugs given for depression, that can have suicidal side effects. They can increase anxiety. I have a gut feelings, there is a bit of protectiveness by drug makers using lawyers, to make sure the issue is minimized.
https://www.center4research.org/antidepressants-increase-suicide-attempts-risks/
Drugs were seen at one time as the answer / cure for psychiatric issues, which is why the mental hospitals were closed down. Unfortunately that was not true.
And creating school environments that are toxic, that force male children to act like females, and removing PE / Physical Activity, is going to result in boys over medicated due to Attention Deficit Order.
Book Review at City Journal.
Soul Doctors
A new book takes an unsparing look at psychiatry's past and future.
Stephen Eide
https://www.city-journal.org/a-critical-look-at-past-and-future-of-psychiatry
And the mental abuse going on in schools with Leftist brainwashing.
Plus what the masking / fear mongering of Did to Childress mental health.
Recent Examples:
Buffalo Shooter - went to school in a hazmat suite.
Texas - got bullied in school due to use of eye liner. Plus Living with grandmother. Self multilated.
Ray, as more info comes out it seems he had only lived with his grandmother for the last few months. Photos of his family show a pretty civilized-looking bunch.
Yep, 24 hour rule on news.
CTD, an astonishing amount of ignorance about ADD and treatments for it on the internet. When some are looking for something to blame, they often grab something of which they have no understanding. And pass it on.
That is exactly what an old school friend of mine who went on to become an internationally recognized child psychologist advocated. She specialized in reading, developed her own program, wrote numerous books, and was considered an authority on teaching children to read, but she also had strong opinions about ADD/ADHD. She said young boys needed just what you have described.
Bullshit.
I don't think its pot. But kids are pumped full of drugs. A kid needs to burn off energy and if you're not letting them run free at times then using medication to control the energy you're hurting them.
Then they pump these kids full of doom and gloom and confusing ideologies to the point were they need anti-depressants. I guarantee this is the problem.
Yes, meth and crack are bad too. But this is long term psychological problems cause by tyrannical people who care more to control the world then to raise healthy well adjusted people.
I think there is a deep connection there,
between a school district where a vocal minority of parents are tagged as suspected domestic terrorists trying to interfere with programs meant to fundamentally transform society... and a school district where the vast majority of parents are transparently understood to need free daycare and therefore see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.
You can have parent participation in raising children, or you can have free daycare, but not both, not really? cf Chicago Public Schools